Sounds like it isn't sporting events or other fans that's the issue.

z

RE - your baseball concerns.

The Aggie Band-a was eliminated on largely trumped up charges.

Physical Education, a hallmark of Davis, was axed - Eliminating a healthy avenue when we have skyrocketing obesity levels, and potentially violating the student funding mechanisms. (I'm guessing the funding goes to some mumbo jumbo causes.)

Your concerns are valid... they didn't add in a little extra legroom at Dobbins?

No extra legroom that I know of. It is a nice ballpark. Needs more handrails though.

It is pretty bad that a school attached to a big medical school is not putting physical wellness first.

LOL. You sure got me good there. I’m not sure how I’ll ever recover.

Here’s the difference. You’re assuming I’m an internet troll based on one single comment I made, which was perfectly valid because of your post.

On the other hand, you said you actively avoid other people at sporting events because they always annoy you and sitting next to people forces you to endure constant annoyances. And hey, there’s nothing wrong with that! You don’t like sitting next to random people at sporting events, you know it, so you move away. Or you avoid events that are going to be sold out or close to it.

But that doesn’t mean my statement was wrong and that other fans are the issue. I’m not saying all fans are perfect and wonderful to be around. They’re obviously not. But you have such issues with fans that you’re going to fewer and fewer sporting events when you can’t essentially have like 5 rows to yourself. So the logical conclusion is that you don’t like being around people you don’t know. And again, there’s nothing wrong with that. You’re certainly not the only one.

z

Goags20172: "Its not nice to attack me."

Also Goags20172: *proceeds to attack another poster*

I wasn't walking back my statement so much as I was clarifying what I meant. I know exactly what I said originally and I do understand how it could be taken harshly, hence why I attempted to clarify what I meant. I was being 100% serious when I said that there's nothing wrong with not wanting to be around random fans at a sporting event. I have a coworker who avoids crowds as well. She knows what she likes and doesn't like and she avoids situations that she knows she won't enjoy. That sounds like what you're doing. You don't like random fans bothering you, so you either don't go or you specifically sit in areas where random fans don't and can't bother you. The enjoyment you get in going to sporting events isn't worth the hassle of enduring constant annoyances. That's perfectly fine. That's how we make choices. We ask ourselves if the positives outweigh the negatives.

z

Why care what I think ? I'm just a random on a message board whom you offended. — Goags20172

Because it was the courteous thing to do? You clearly took my statement in a way I didn't necessarily intend (not your fault in any way) so I wanted to clarify what I meant. Apparently you thought I was just being a dick with my followup so I attempted to reiterate that I wasn't.

The Battered Bastards of Baseball is a great documentary.
It reminds me of the old Portland i grew up with, and my folks grew up with in the late 70's and 80's. A lot has changed there now with Portland's institutions, though much of the people haven't.

For the record folks, we allow free speech and open discussion on this site. Just keep it civil and be an adult. Please don't let political propaganda, or the tribal effect erase your good sense. We're all Aggies here (well, most of us) and just want to get at the issue of what's going on with the Baseball program, and what's the next step to remedy that issue.

I've recommended it to friends. I've never been. Around the same Era as a young, healthy Bill Walton? Has Portland gone too far (to some?), have drugs, 'homelessness', and anarchy gone too far?

Stories like this, the Angels Ohtani, and The Greek Freak are what I love about sports.

Two players leaving:

https://www.davisenterprise.com/sports/blue-devils/carrell-brothers-to-take-baseball-talents-from-ucd-to-oklahoma/

This is not good news for those of us who once thought that this was “no big deal” situation. If the UC Davis Faculty Athletics Representative’s (Scott Carrell) 2 kids leave the program, this is a very big deal. And they have left. Strong evidence that the MBB team will be terminated as a UC Davis varsity sport. Maybe not forever, but for a significant period of time.

And the foot dragging continues. A highly regarded retired attorney posted to Bob Dunning's baseball article and stated that an investigation could largely be completed within a few weeks. Incompetence, or purposeful?

Sorry to see the Caroll boys go. I’ve known them since little league. Good kids from a good family. This does not bode well for the Aggie program

Movie I don't think it is purposeful. The damage is done. The MBB program is done. Maybe the wait could be attributed to letting the kids out of the program before the sky falls in on the team. I it might be too early to get totally into the blame game, but the blame for this dreadful situation may lie at the feet of our esteemed prior AD who recently and very abruptly left his post. Why did he let this get by him? Why did the head coach allow this? For how long did this go on?

Kevin Blue did not "leave very abruptly." He gave months of notice.

His integrity was beyond question and he did as much, if not more, than any AD that I can remember to elevate the entire athletics program during his tenure. You can be assured that none of this baseball stuff was happening on his watch and, if it did, he knew nothing at all about it.

Retired attorney Lawrence Booher, in reply to a Bob Dunning MBB article:

"Before retirement, I was a labor lawyer for a large company. From time to time we conducted internal investigations of serious matters ... I cannot recall any case that took more than two weeks to resolve - including my review which often lead to additional interviews or documentation. (Note - in cases of potential termination for incompetence, the process was much more lengthy ... ) In most cases, the majority of the work was done in less than a week. One or two people(two is better) conduct interviews of the complainants, those complained against, and possible witnesses. Relevant documentation is copied. My review. Presentation of the findings to management including recommended action. It is not a time consuming process, even if there are several claimed victims, accused, and witnesses. Most HR professionals have carried out investigations many times and know how to do it. On reflection, I cannot conceive what could delay completion of an investigation for four months. Suggestion - make an inquiry in a few weeks and ask how many interviews have already been conducted. If the answer is several, ask what more interviews are needed and what is the delay? If the answer is few, suggest more experienced investigators should be brought in. Good column."

Corporate America = 2 weeks
University (government) = 4 - 6 months (politics?)

Took 6+ months to investigate, document, and prosecute a pretty open/shut issue at my gov't office--and that was with everyone in the office.

BlueGold. I guess I agree with most of what you say or hope that I do, AD Blue was the class act of ADs in all of the BS and BWC Conferences. Smart and handsome with PhD. Made UCD vary proud, indeed. His next stop would/should have have naturally been in a power conference school. He was always on the rise! Then he left. For Golf Canada. Why? BG the guy did give ample notice, but what does that mean? That He knew before anyone else? Total speculation at this point. Hey, we are all in the dark here, but these kinds of discussions are fine and good for the program in my view. Long investigations, however, prompt conspiracy theories and I DO NOT want to go there. So, speed this thing UP!

z

Reddit rumors.

"curmudgeonthefrog 26d
"I heard from someone in the baseball team that the culture was super toxic. Any student who wanted to succeed academically would be discouraged by teammates and coaching staff. So everyone was forced to pick from a few of the easier majors. And even then during athlete study times no one studied. And since baseball season meant frequent away trips it was impossible to study or take exams on the road. Other than that i dont know what else was going on."

I post this because I believe I can largely debunk it. Players majors:

6 - Managerial Economics
6 - Communications

4 - Economics
3 - Mechanical Engineering
2 - Undeclared - Physical Sciences
2 - Computer Science
2 - Undeclared
2 - Political Science

1 -
Environmental Design
Viticulture & Enology
Land. Architecture
English
Food Sciences
Wildlife Biology
Human Development
Undeclared - Life Sciences
Psychology
Sociology

I actually think it's a pretty impressive list. Maybe a few more Comm majors than normal, but only 1 Sociology major, no ethnic or similiar majors. Managerial Econ a legit major.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UCDavis/comments/okgb1f/does_anybody_have_any_idea_what_happened_with_the/?utm_source=amp&utm_medium=&utm_content=comments_view_all

I had actually heard those rumors about UCLA. Perhaps the Reddit poster is someone from a different region of the country unfamiliar with the UC system ?

I seriously doubt any student-athletes were discouraged from pursuing rigorous courses of study. I had a couple of friends who were on the team near the end of Phil Swimley's coaching career. One of them told me he was having some troubles in one or more of his classes and the coaches gave him a couple of days of practice off per week so he could concentrate on his studies and get his grades up. He did not see a reduction in playing time. That isn't the mark of a coaching staff that doesn't care about the well-being of its student-athletes. How is that relevant today ? Matt Vaughn and assistant coach Lloyd Acosta were, if I'm not mistaken, both assistants under Swimley (Acosta maybe only 1 season) and UCD graduates. If anyone would be sympathetic to the challenges of being a UCD student-athlete they would be. And it's not as if Rex Peters would have been less so. If you're paying the big dough to attend a private school like Chapman you're going for the academics, not the baseball. Chapman is either Division III or NAIA. Either way you're not going there to get drafted, and you're not there on an athletic scholarship.

I can't discount the possibility of toxicity in the UCD clubhouse though. Peters alluded to it after the 2009 season (or perhaps during it-don't recall the exact timing of the CA Aggie article). A lot of me-first attitudes were cited-more freshmen than usual- who were used to being the BMOC. There was some effort the next season to promote more of a team attitude and they did significantly better in 2010 (still a losing record), but the me-first seemed to re-surface in 2013 (Vaughn head coach then) when Steven Patterson seemed to be the only infielder who showed up to both hit at a high level and play solid defense. This year you had just Jalen Smith and Spencer Gedestad do that in the infield

Hitting and defense are supposed to be both individual and team-level pursuits. If the players were truly treating them as such the team wouldn't strand so many runners or make so many fielding errors. Vaughn's area of expertise is pitching, and that's suffering too because of the weak defense and hitting. Jalen Smith was this year's version of Steven Patterson, although it's not the best comparison because Smith is more versatile defensively. I don't mean to discount the contributions of Cooper Morrison and Spencer Gedestad, but honestly I believe the true measure of a program's strength is how the underclassmen perform. Excelling at hitting as a fifth-year senior is kind of like being the tallest kid in your class because you were held back a year. And double that for all these sixth year stars this year like Sac State's Matt Smith and the guy at Santa Clara who set the school homerun record.

At the very least I believe the UCD team is dysfunctional. And it's only natural some toxicity would accompany the constant losing.

For the record, I posted the item that seemed most measured and in some sense, possible. So we've now debunked much of it several ways.

Yeah, that seems like it would be odd to suspend the entire baseball program because the coaching staff fostered a culture that discouraged studying and academic success. Seems like you'd just fire the coaching staff if that was the case. And if there was a toxic culture among the players as well, you just tell the new coaching staff to make sure academics are a priority and if some players don't like it, they don't play. Guarantee the coaching staff you back them for a few years to build a better culture and bring in players who buy in that way they're not focused on a quick fix/aren't worried about having a couple horrible seasons as they turn the program around.

Anyone else catch the Owen Yancher reference re 2 Transfers?

"When Oklahoma head coach Skip Johnson and several players confessed their shared love of fishing, it made the move from Cowtown to the Sooner State even more appealing."

Anyone have any updates? School starting in like a a week.

From the wording of that press release they originally sent out it sounded like the investigation wasn't even going to begin until the fall quarter. I believe the reasoning might have something to do with the fact that both the school officials and returning team members would be on campus then for them to interview. If that's the reason why, then it's a pretty stupid one. If the hazing were conducted by upperclassmen, as hazing typically is, then it would make little difference if everyone were on campus. Some of the offending parties would have already graduated and would not be returning. If it's a serious enough matter you drag people in right away to interview them.

More likely the school officials investigating the case didn't consider it worth interrupting their summer breaks.

At this time I haven't heard anything, but I have done a little (very little) internet searching and have uncovered two potential clues that this is nowhere near finished.

1. The team Twitter account hasn't had a single post since before the original press release, nor does it seem that players or coaches have talked about the issue on their own social media accounts. The university likely instructed them to remain silent under penalty of losing their jobs/enrollment at the school if the investigation were to be compromised. As with a jury trial there is usually a very tight lid at the beginning that loosens as details are leaked. We're in tight lid phase right now.

2. No baseball schedule. It is very common for UCD to not have released a schedule in September: usually this happens in December or later. What is uncommon is that apparently no school thus far (that I can tell) has released a baseball schedule that includes UCD as an opponent. This detail could be nothing. Maybe the actual opponents are among those who haven't released their schedules yet. But not even one ? That's suspicious.

If the D1 baseball site where coaches have a bulletin board for requesting opponents is to be believed, then it would appear that UCD was still actively seeeking at least two weekend series at the time the team was suspended. One of the posts even had an early July 2021 timestamp. Since the coaching staff is responsible for scheduling, and not the athletic dept, I seriousvly doubt anyone is working on it right now. And it's likely some teams they did schedule have bowed out or will cancel due to the uncertainty.

I haven't seen anything yet that strongly suggests the program will be eliminated, but it looks more and more like there won't be a 2022 season. The biggest reason is the lack of time to prepare. They can't hold the full team practice schedule in the winter, even if the NCAA allowed it, due to the colder temperatures and wetter weather. That's just asking for more injuries.

Even if they made it to opening day unscathed the team would be so under-prepared that even the weakest opponents would slaughter them. For one thing, getting stretched out to be a starting pitcher or even a multi-inning reliever is a longer process. You're not getting that done in a few weeks. They can't use a bunch of 1-2 inning pitchers to cover the whole game like the Giants have often done of late. San Francisco can claim players off waivers or summon reinforcements from the minor leagues-can't do that in college baseball.

I have to wonder if they even would have enough players to fill a roster at this point. At least ten players graduated in 2021. In addition the Carrell (sp ?)brothers are gone. UCD baseball typically does not announce signing classes that are as large as other D-I universities', which could be a reflection of both the more stringent entrance requirements and the reduced year-to-year turnover (fewer two-year transfers in other words).
And now we know at least 1 member of the class that was to replace the graduates has already de-committed (Luke Carrell). The summer is also a time when some uncommited players can find their ways to UCD, but that activity has been stopped because of the suspension.

So what do you do if the team is cleared this month and you need at least 6-10 more players in a hurry ? Hold campus try-outs ? Do you really want to see what will happen when all the players who wouldn't have made the team under normal circumstances suddenly do ? At most you'd likely only find 1-2 keepers.

The outside attorneys motivation is to maximize billable hours. Administrators / bureaucrats don't move like private business. Interesting that the first and only (?) players to transfer are the Facultys Reps (Scott Carrell) sons.

I'm guessing playing this season is far more preferable. Bring in an 1-2 ex Aggie players / coaches with a keen eye to help recruit a few overlooked players, maybe a few Sophs from NorCal JCs. Add a couple walk on. Solicit inquiries. Aggie Pride. Practice in Rec Hall, batting practice in the racketball courts?

Well, the key here is distinguishing whether it's just the team or the program that is suspended. I understand it to mean that there will be no NCAA ( suspension doesn't cover the club team I believe) baseball-related activities for UCD until the investigation is complete. If that's the case then it wouldn't do them any good to bring in replacement players or coaches.

The types of players you're suggesting they recruit as replacements they already do. Their maiin recruiting classes are mostly the un-flashy, overlooked, possibly under-sized, players make up most of the team in normal years. I don't want to say UCD has to scrape the bottom of the barrell, because that would be harsh and not really true, but the academic requirements and the pecking order in D-I baseball recruiting don't leave as wide of a selection of players as say Sac State. And continuous losing affects the pecking order and recruits'perception of the program.

The suspension is UCD's way of freezing future financial commitments. The hazing allegations may not have contained any complaints against the coaches, but they suspended them anyway to keep them from scheduling more games or recruiting players.

One other thing is that we don't know the full extent of the attrition. We know about the Carrell brothers leaving but how many other departures don't we know about ? Even more key players could be gone-one of us just hasn't located any evidence yet.

Also, we don't know if the NCAA will ultimately decide on the punishments, or if they will accept self-imposed ones. It could well be that UCD will not have the final decision. One thing's for sure-a postseason ban for UCD baseball will probably be a nothing punishment. It would be like telling The Incredible Hulk that he is not allowed to ride a bicycle.