Yes, knee-jerk reaction. You clearly saw the announcements about Sac State, flipped out, and said, "OMG, Davis needs to do this immediately-or else !" Except perhaps you wouldn't say OMG.

Student indifference to UCD sports teams is nothing new. Had it not been for the Aggie Pack rewards system I would've probably skipped most, if not all, basketball and football games, while never seeing soccer, volleyball, gymnastics, or water polo. Call it what it was-a bribery system. The people who stood in line for hours at Aggie Jam-all of them there for the t-shirts. How many of them actually showed up for regular season games ? More than one game ? The other students I saw at these events were never classmates and rarely even from my dorm, which suggests to me even the influence of the Aggie Pack during its heyday was not that deep; they just reached enough students across the school who wanted free stuff to make attendace figures impressive. Once in the door if they stayed they participated, if only just to yell mean things at the visiting team and "fight" for pizza. Absent the regular bribes I don't see how they can even approach getting students interested today. And then you would have to fight larger growing factors among students like general disinterest in sports and extreme social anxiety. You can't fix these with just a flashy new coach.

Some marketing geniuses need to find ways to get people interested again without resorting to frivolous expenditures.

I disagree. I think the program is too good, and it needs to lose more often.

Mediocrity isn't being defended. Rash, knee-jerk responses to Sac State's actions are being rejected.

Don't hold your breath if you are waiting for Davis to enact short-sighted publicity stunts like this....Davis moves deliberately with a long-term view.

Exactly. When has UCD ever dismissed a coach who wasn't getting terrible results ? Matt Vaughn (baseball) comes close, but I think "terrible" is a little strong, and he wasn't fired. I think his contract was up anyway. Maybe a pre-Biggs football coach ?

I'm not. I embraced change when I altered my perspective on how important it is for UCD sports teams to win everything, especially when I attend. This wasn't yesterday.

I determined that when I visited Davis for a game the only part I consistently enjoyed was the pre-game meal (often Steve's Pizza or the Hotdogger, occasionally Tres Hermanas) because my overall enjoyment of the trip was mostly based on the
outcome of the game, influenced in part by the costs of attendance. I felt there was something wrong with that so I decided I could either find a way to enjoy them no matter what or just stop going. Not worth getting upset and having a bad time.

The time away has allowed me time to reflect on what matters and how hard the coaches and players (and some of the administrators) work to put together and execute these events. I also thought about how the price of a ticket doesn't entitle me to call for a coach to be terminated over them not winning. That's change.

If the student body isn't vested in the program now, does that merit a larger investment ? If the students don't come out, lack of interest is a big factor. If they aren't interested do you think the lack of winning is driving that, or could it be that they just don't care because they have bigger priorities ? You can try to make the games more appealing.. In the end though, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

These sports teams belong to the students first and foremost because they pay the student fees. If they aren't interested in supporting their teams because they'd rather blow bubbles/confetti, or share every aspect of their lives on social media, maybe it's time to re-evaluate the entire sports program and its cost to them. If they really are this indifferent no basketball team is going to change that. I'm not in favor of throwing more of someone else's money at a coaching experiment that may not deliver results. And how important is the basketball team's level of success anyway ? Worth losing sleep over ?

We look at these things through the perspective of alumni. It's very easy to fall into the trap of thinking the school owes us highly-competitive teams for life. The sports teams don't exist solely to provide entertainment for hard-to-please alumni. They do not owe us a championship basketball team. If they could find ways to sufficiently attract potential students and community participation/investment without a sports program I'd be ok with that.

Look, I enjoyed the sports as a student, but I also recognize that younger people don't share my interests, and the UCD athletics experiences I enjoyed as a student are never coming back. Fun memories-that's it. New memories can be formed but they will not be the same. Times change and so do priorities. Perhaps the athletics dept isn't tuned in enough to what the students want. It doesn't have to be one extreme or the other. It doesn't need to be "go-all-in" or get rid of the program. They've found a happy medium, and that's fine. Davis can be Davis, and Sac State can be Sac State.

If I'm not mistaken, Moroski played both sports when they were primarily had N. California opponents like Chico State and Cal State Hayward (now East Bay). There was significantly less travel.

The other part is the increased physical preparation now required for UCD baseball players. Back in the 1990's it was considered noteworthy that Justin Reid (who made it to Triple-A with the Pirates) could hit the low 90's with his fastball in D-II.. Today, in Division II or III you can find pitchers throwing mid-high 90's (with varying degrees of control). It just speaks to how competitve it is these days. Since people don't naturally throw 95 that means more strength training and conditioning.

So Pinnick isn't a pitcher. Maybe he should be, considering a quarterback is responsible for making strong, accurate throws at varying distances. Also, the high school hitting stats are pretty weak. Of course I found those on Maxpreps.com, so they might not be completely accurate. That site depends on the coaches to report game stats. Some coaches do so irregularly; some don't do it all. Even as an outfielder he'll have to train and practice more than he did in high school.

I've seen a couple of kickers/punters pull off the two-sport thing in college, but their football preparation is different.

I doubt Pinnick ever plays baseball for UCD. The football time commitment is too much for that to happen, especially if he is the starting quarterback. If he were a kicker/punter that would be a different situation.

Applying Storage Wars to this situation I think Sac State aspires to be like Renè (the 300-lb German guy with the busty wife). Perhaps his wife's breasts are a symbol of their ambitions ?

It's also possible they wind up like Barry, the old guy who blows so much of his family's money on crap lockers. Prior to these moves by Sac State, they were more like Mary, buying cheap lockers with the stated purpose of refurbishing things + re-selling them.

UCD is more like Ivy Calvin, the ex-college football player who runs Grandma's Attic. Ivy is really smart, rarely loses big, but he's rarely the biggest winner. Everything's ok except somebody keeps dumping old pee-stained mattresses at his shop.

Our good players are 6'2" and 6"4". Their good players are 6'2", 6'5", 6'8" and 6'10".

So what ? Is it the stated mission of UCD to field an elite basketball team with a mix of only players that satisfies the peanut gallery of posters on a message board ? He gets quite a few wins for having such a disadvantaged short team. What would the excuse be if they had some additional tall players and didn't play significantly better ? I trust he is playing to his coaching strengths by prioritizing guards, and that is fine because he knows so much more about coaching basketball (and playing it too) than any of us. He is the expert. We are not.

False. I'm told Bobby Steinberg was terrific. Football gets recruits. We don't need 'a lot', we need 2-3 key recruits. We're not Bako, we have a GREAT campus and town. Try recruiting at UOP or Eastern Washington. Key signings from bright SA who want a UC degree and a post career like Payne or Parenteau. Look at the success of UCSD.

A lot of words to unpack here too. I'm assuming you are referring to Kent State coach Bobby Steinburg ? Kent is Kent and Davis is Davis. It's also in a different part of the country, not everyone aspires to be in CA. Maybe Kent State Is more attractive a destination for those who choose to go there, mass shootings (as opposed to stabbings)aside ? I didn't say Davis is unattractive to recruits because of its size and population, so a comparison to Kent is irrelevant. That UCSD is in La Jolla doesn't take away from the fact it's still a more attractive destination than Davis.

Football gets recruits, good recruits, and they win. However, they also play against basically minor league college football teams. Basketball doesn't play in a minor league classification-they can and do play anyone who will work out a sufficiently favorable contract with them, more frequently against teams that are a lot better than they are. If basketball only played 2 such teams a year they would definitely win a bit more. I sometimes read articles on mlbtraderumors.com where they talk about players having pitched or hit better in Triple-A than they have in their brief MLB careers to date. Well no sh!t, Sherlock !

Oh, and sometimes football doesn't win, like in the playoffs. What football does is irrelevant to basketball's performance.

Momentum helps. You only need 2-3 key recruits, and role players. Start winning, getting 4-6,000 in the house, momentum builds. Football and women's basketball don't have the same turnover.

They get key recruits and role players, and so do the teams that beat UCD.

Are you planning to summon these extra fans via a time machine from the past or use the Burt Wonderstone trick of gassing everyone at a Mondavi Center event, transporting them to the ARC before they wake up in a "disappearing audience" gag ? There needs to be a massive shake-up in the way people prioritize their leisure activities before UCD basketball becomes that relevant again. And football attendance is irrelevant. Brutes hitting each other while some guy tries to run away has great universal appeal. This has been true for thousands of years.

If you don't like how the team is playing, and it causes you so much frustration that you're calling for a coach to be replaced, then you have the option to not follow it instead of letting it get to you. Outside of the team and coaches very few people actually have to live and die with the fortunes of a college sports team (and I don't count gamblers), I don't feel like you've made a compelling enough argument for Les to be replaced before his contract is up, wasting money and trying to solve a problem that isn't there.

You folks do know that Les isn't solely responsible for player performance, right ? The players themselves bear a greater share of that responsibility. He can only instruct them what to do to prepare (practice), what to during the game + when to do it. The execution is purely in their court (pun intended).

If the coaches are recruiting the all-county everythings they claim to be recruiting then it's not that they are recruiting inferior players. The players are good. Other teams have good players too, and this isn't like the D-II days when they could just out-smart the majority of the big dummies playing for the other teams (except for Bakersfield)

I know that as alumni we think our school is great and can accomplish anything, especially because it's very affirming when there is success. However, I only believe UCD can do that academically. Athletically there are more limits. Could another coach take the same players and turn them into a national powerhouse. No, because the players aren't THAT good.

The best recruiter in the world couldn't convince a lot of the best players to come to Davis if they don't want to be in a place like Davis. You know, free-will and that stuff. UCD is not the be-all-end-all of existence some alumni think it is. You could hire Michael Jordan as the coach with Larry Bird as his assistant and they still wouldn't sign. Well, to be fair, some of them might not be familiar with his career considering it was ancient history before they were even born.

Knowing that there is a ceiling and accepting that it exists puts things into perspective. A different coach might help them get a slightly closer look at it, but not significantly. I would say if Les were doing a horrible job or mistreating the players that would be one thing. He isn't though, so let the man finish providing the services for which he's receiving contractually-obligated payments. When it's over you can hire a new coach. Honestly, some of you folks act like money is no object when it's somebody else's. Are you going to foot the bill for termination costs ? You might as well all be CA politicians.

And keeping up with Sac State should also not be a huge goal. They may have a little more potential upward mobility because they're less-encumbered by academic requirements, and they are in a more interesting place.. And if they succeed-great. If they produce something fantastic I may go see it sometime because I'm not obligated to be a cheerleader of everything UCD for life.

They are fortunate to not be finishing against the top teams in the conference. Of their last 3 BW series (counting the one they're in) only UCSD has a winning record. There's really not much of a path to 5th place for the Aggies, so no ticket to the Big West tournament. As a result their season will end a week earlier this year.

They get locked in a fair number of these low-scoring wars of attrition because the team hitting isn't very good (.250 batting average is pretty weak considering aluminum bats are being used). It seems like all of the returning players except Nick Leehey (who seems to have missed significant time with injury), Ryan Lee, and Braydon Wooldridge are not hitting as well as they did last year. I wonder what's behind that-rule changes (such as an adjustment to the strike zone) ? A change in team hitting approach ? They do seem to be drawing more walks. I seriously doubt all of them went into a prolonged slump at the same time for no reason.

I'm not concerned with the freshmen. Players like Gentil, Story, and Houston Hirschkorn have shown some real promise. I seem to recall there was a game in which Gentil had two triples. He's a catcher. Catchers usually aren't supposed to be hitting triples !

These statistics are a little telling though. UCD has been shut out SEVEN times this year, to go with 8 times they scored only 1 run. In those 15 combined games they are (2-13) and scored 8 total runs.

What's really weird is the team batting average has been at or near .250 each year since Nicholson took over as head coach (per the historical stats on the UCD website). They hit .238 in 2022 but probably would have hit .250 had the hazing scandal not resulted in some of their regulars ditching the program. So this year is- consistent ?

One crucial element they've mostly been lacking is power. Seventeen team homeruns would've been ok in the D-II days. Homeruns end these types of games much faster than piecemeal offense (walks, getting hit with pitches, etc). They hit 33 last year and the year before that. Must be missing Damian Stone more than they imagined. He was the only major bat they lost to graduation last year. Seventeen is how many they hit in '22 (6-34 won-loss record). The 2022 Aggies hit that many in 5 fewer games.

Pitching, on the other hand, has improved significantly. The team ERA alone has dropped a lot in each of the last 3 years.

Well, let's see. They won 7 games this year. Doubling that in year 1 would qualify as success.

If the hornet men's team makes it to the WBIT or WNIT, they will win it when all the other teams forfeit

I don't know that this deal with Bibby will necessarily translate into a winning program. He's done well at the high school level, but this is a totally new level of competition.

There is an invisible ceiling above most, if not all, of Sac State programs, just like UCD. They can bring in very good coaches, like Brian Katz and Reggie Christiansen, but they're still stuck at the very modest success level. They don't win conference championships for the most part, but they do alright. So they try to recruit better players because the coaches aren't the problem. So does everyone else.

Bibby's name value may give them a boost, but Sac State is still Sac State. What can it reasonably do to attract the elite talent as a commuter school that offers an alright but nothing special experience ?

That UCD won 2 of 3 in baseball means they will again host 2 in 2026.

It will be interesting to see what the schedule will look like when they enter the Mountain West. None of the Big West opponents are fits for mid-week games, so it will probably the usual suspects minus Nevada. I think they will be relieved to not be obligated to play UCI, Fullerton, and UCSB every year.

I wonder if, with all the additional conference travel, they will play fewer mid-week games.

Per her Wofford profile Helen is originally from New Zealand. I wonder if she watched and liked "Flight of the Conchords" ?

Wofford plays their home games at Jerry Richardson Indoor Stadium. I'm glad they make the distinction for the benefit of fans who might wonder if Wofford basketball games are played outside.

Exactly, they have no guarantee these talented misfits will be able to play well together. Does the new coach have a magic elixir that will make the troubled players into model student-athletes that the previous coaches didn't know about? We'll find out. Right now Marion might as well be Adam Sandler's character in "The Longest Yard" (haven't seen the original). Like Paul Crewe he'll be looking to get out soon.

I hope this first roster is merely Marion doing an initial jumpstart with players of his choosing (like re-decorating your new office when you get promoted), and not his long-term strategy. It won't be good for Sac State's image if they get a reputation for being Jailbird U., not that any program is flawless.

Not failed. I enjoyed posting some ridiculous ideas. If you see me posting something like that it's for my own enjoyment. I know better than to expect anyone else on this board to have a sense of humor when it comes to football or really anything.

Kind of presumptuous to have him pictured in a Sac State uniform before he's even been presented an offer.

This positional allocation of rooms seems like an inefficient use of space. The kickers and punters can just use a couple of storage closets because they're typically rather thin-ish men, right ?

The running backs and wide receivers can just go meet outside or on the treadmills in the gym becauase running is kind of their thing. Or better yet, Coach Plough can just make a bunch of YouTube videos in which he draws all over the screen like John Madden, and they can watch these on their computers at home. That way they don't all get COVID-25 from each other. Then maybe they could convert the football rooms into student housing and use Toomey Field (yes, I know they don't play there anymore) as green space for all the campus hippies.