I went by the D2 board and radio silence from Simon Fraser and Western Oregon, but a good deal of chatter from the Central Washington fans. Apparently they have a long term deal for out of conference games with the Lone Star Conference, but most people acknowledge it is not long term sustainable. It kind of leaves them the options of moving up to FCS, moving down to NAIA, convincing regional NAIA schools to move to D2, or drop football. The problem is of course that D2 is the right place for their basketball teams, they can't afford the jump to FCS, and don't want to take the prestige hit of dropping down to NAIA where most of the competitors are 500-student bible colleges. In the case of SFU, their facilities are all built to American standards rather than Canadian. CWU is similar in character to EWU, but the cautionary tale they tell is that despite EWU's on-field success, their budget is a perennial disaster that puts them on the chopping block, even with some big name donors.

Considering how many football players California high schools generate of all skill levels, it seems strange and a disservice that there are such limited options for college players that don't measure up to FCS skill level. I suppose economics started going south in the early 90's and many CSU campuses became less residential in nature. A complaint I've seen on the D2 boards, and I can't verify if it is true, is that smaller public universities on the west coast have trouble attracting quality chancellors/presidents and athletic directors. The assertion is that they tend to inherit late-career administrators from bankrupt east coast private universities who are seeking a 3-5 year refuge to lock in a secure state pension, and as such they are survivalists rather than visionaries.

I hesitate to get into the topic of public employment pensions....it's an emotionally charged issue and we have travelled down that path already in the last year. There are a lot of rumors out there on public employee pensions and to be sure there are a lot of ugly stories about pension abuses.

I have no idea what the formulae are for UC and CSU pensions, but I suspect that five years of even a high end job at a UC or CSU is not going to put anyone on Easy Street. I cannot imagine that there is a whole lot of reciprocity with out-of state private universities.

But I could be wrong. I often am.

In the spirit of disclosure I retired after over 35 years in a professional/management level job with a municipal public agency with its own pension system (not managed by Calpers.) Had I worked there for five years, even five years at the end of my career, you would see me at intersections with a crudely lettered cardboard sign asking for spare change.

My understanding was 3%, per year, of the highest 3-year run.

During the early buy out, the UC was giving qualified individuals an extra 5 years towards their retirement pension. Some took retirement & benifits from the pension system, and then came back to work part time.

The formula for UC pension has 3 components. Average salary over last 3 years, number of years and an age factor. The age factor changed several years back but the way mine was (I’m old) is that it varied linearly from 1-2.5% dependent on a retirement age of 50-60. So, 2.5% is cap if you take retirement at or after 60. I think the new formula starts at 55 and caps at 65.

So, for example 20 years at age 60 would be a multiplier of 20x2.5=50% of the average salary.


If they can opt out of the pension and get money out into a 401k (403b for UC) that’s probably a better bet.

Extra years of credit is a great incentive!

And this is why I hesitated, and probably should have resisted, getting into public employment retirement plans.

Like so much in life, particularly in the age of social media, there are a lot of rumors and stories out there. Years ago my wife and I sat at a dinner table with an elderly couple from a town in the Sierras. They ran a little B&B place, and were not big fans of local government, taxes, regulations, etc. as one might expect. That's fine. They said that in their county all of the jobs were given to friends and relatives of one family and that employees were able to retire after 5 years with a full pension. That is highly unlikely. I looked up the county later. The county's retirement plan is managed by CalPers. No one is getting a pension of 20% per year.

As Dr. Mike noted, most pensions involve three factors: salary, length of service and an age related multiplier. That was the same for the local government for which I worked for over 35 years. As you get older the multiplier increases, but 2.5% sounds about right for people in their 60s. Safety employees...think peace officers and firemen,...get a little better deal, with something like 3% at 50 (or 55?) years of age...and where I worked they maxed out at 90% of their highest salary, so there was no incentive to work beyond 30 years.

Also you probably don't get to start work in your 20s and retire in 5 years and collect a pension of any size. Usually you have to work a certain number of years, say 10, or be a relatively high age, like over 60, to collect retirement. Even in the former case you cannot collect the pension until you reach a certain age, say 50. You may start at 20 and "retire" from that job after 10 years at 30, but you cannot collect your pension until you are 50...and the multiplier for retiring at age 50 is pretty low.

3% per year, for employees other than safety personnel sounds very high. Even at that, coming to California to scoop up that enticing pension...3% for 5 years would give you a pension of 15% of your salary. Not the gold mine at the western end of the rainbow that people seem to think it is.

But, I digress.

Good points, all. I also think you need at least 10 years to get the retiree health package, unless this is somehow negotiable for executives. Anyhow, didn’t mean to start politics about pensions. Probably lots of reasons why Humboldt doesn’t get long-tenured visionary executives these days. At any rate, it’s kind of a shame that D2 west of Texas is basically gone. CA high schools probably generate enough players to stock a D2 conference and at least one more FCS team, but I guess there’s not a good financial model to make it work.

Don't forget current gender equity requirements.

FWIW, we had a string of 3 years and out athletic directors... Gale Mikels (?), Sochor, and was Keith Williams one? Soch actually had over 2 years as AD, and 6 months or more on leave or sabbatical, to get him to 3 years as AD.

And again, a hint of why I should not have gone down this path...

The big difference between someone like Sochor and the D2 website tales about someone coming in from outside of the UC system to be an AD for three years, (besides Sochor being a legend who can do no wrong and entitled to whatever he got,) is that an outsider under that example would have a whopping 3 years of service with the university whereas Sochor had all those earlier years of coaching in addition to whatever time he spent as AD. I believe he was an assistant coach from 1967-1969, head coach from 1970-1988 and AD from 1989-91. (Wikipedia...) That's roughly 24 years with Davis. Might even have more service from his 4 or 5 seasons at S.F. State if there is reciprocity between the CSU and UC systems. Assume 24 years...and retiring at 2.5% per year...he's at 60%. The outsider would be at 7.5%.

And yes there are arguments to be made about employees who finish strong for three years, set their three year look-back at that high level and then retire, allowing someone else to have their turn. Rumors, tales and stories abound about things like that....but we have gone too far from Aggie sports already.

Another anecdote about rumors...I recall a discussion on the D2 football site many, many years ago in which someone from, I believe NDSU, commented that UC was tuition free to California residents. If those days ever existed, they were long gone by the time the comment was made. I did a quick unscientific look and concluded that in-state tuition at UC was more expensive than out-of-state tuition at NDSU.

Those tuition free days at UC really existed. In the early 70s, there was no tuition and fees were about $600. Books were expensive as was room and board. I remember sweating about signing a lease with tree other guys to rent an apartment for 255 a month. Beer was only $1.25 a pitcher so the $600 in fees seemed like tuition to some.

There was also a semantic game being played, I think. "Fees" were $xxx, but there wasn't a "tuition" charge, IIRC.

That was my opinion at the time, but in retrospect we paid practically nothing and the fees weren’t really paying for our education.

I think when I started the “student fees” were $68.50 per quarter and quickly jumped to a whopping $108.50. Probably in the $300.00 range by the time I graduated. No, we could not pay with a couple of chickens or a calf.

But by the time of the D2 Football.com boards the tales of tuition-free or outright free-free education for California residents was a thing of the past.

Of course someone can now do some research and prove just how much my memory is failing me.

call the exchange of money what you will, you are correct that the cost of college has gone up dramatically since the 70s at a higher rate than incomes or inflation. Today, about 60% of UCD students receive “free” base tuition from the regents based on income... a value of about $12k per year, and a figure the brass like to tout. But that doesn’t make things affordable, unless maybe you live with your parents. Books, food, fees, rent... dorm contracts alone are pushing $20k per year now. So not the kind of thing the 15 hours a week at Unitrans will pay for. The rub is that if you go out and write your essays and earn scholarships, the regents reduce your tuition waiver by that amount. So in essence you can’t start to cover your non tuition expenses with scholarships until you’ve earned at least $12k. Donors should be aware that most students benefit from a $500 Safeway gift card under the table more than a $1000 scholarship through Dutton Hall.

I did the free/free education at the JC. The local college had scholarships funded by a community bank for everyone who had a B average in high school. That paid what little fees they had
A few hundred dollars went a long way in those days as the $1.25 cost for a pitcher of beer illustrates. I certainly don’t remember the dollar and cents but the $600 fee stuck in my head as a round number. I think that could be legitimately not called tuition. Fees supported non educational costs.
Fast forward a generation and my daughter did four years at UCLA 2001 thru 2004 The tuition which we paid for without aid even though we were not dramatically above the median income for UCLA families still cost less than her Catholic high school. But by then they were calling it tuition.
The situation is worse now I’m sure. The current cost often far outweighs the financial benefits for a significant percentage of students. Back in the 70s, that wasn’t likely to be the case. Broken system.

The middle class families are the ones that pay the price, especially when it comes to professional school. Those kids (in prof programs) are graduating with $150,000 + in student loans. Outrageous. I had a student from south america that i mentored through her undergraduate program. She was an average student. When she graduated, i asked her about her student loan debt. Nada. Free ride for everything including living expenses.

I don’t want to wade into political waters but I absolutely agree with you. The narrative that those with graduate or professional degrees will land huge salaries right out of school and payoff the debt no problem is false for many. I wish there was an easy answer as to why education is so overpriced. It’s easy to point at chancellor pay and dubious make-work departments, but I fear it’s more complex than that.

Across the continent we had an interring system going at NC State. Some employees would retire after 5 years and get medical coverage for life (0 premium). I know at least 2 young guys who “retired” from NC State after 5 years. The university finally got some actuarial sense and increased that to something lime 15-20 years. I came into the University system later in life so just went with 401b 457, etc. that turned out to be a wise choice. I had colleagues who were on federal retirement systems (federal research was the system) and retired at full salary. It got to be so i work or retire with the same salary. A pretty easy choice. And their salaries were quite good (maybe not up to Bay Area standards).

I do know that CSU faculty salaries are an issue (don’t know about retirement).

Employee head count, salaries, benefits, student amenities, all are higher than they were years ago, funded by loaning money to people who may not be able to repay it.
Private sector working middle class parents aren’t usually going to pay their kids graduate school debt, because they have to save to make up for the pensions they don’t get.